Buckdog

You'll notice that without the aid of the state, they would not be able to steal those billions? Greed empowered and encouraged by the state is the evil we are facing right now.

Just sayin.

Your friendly neighbourhood free market anarchist.

;)

Meanwhile in New York, Madoff is on bail, sitting in the luxury apartment that his stolen billions purchased. Justice? ... I could ALMOST be convinced to believe in capital punishment ....

Oh and by the way ... for all of you 'bible believing' unfettered free-market types ... here is what your Jesus had to say on the topic:
"It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God." -Mark 10:25

"For it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God." -Luke 18:25

Oh leftdog, I agree...Madoff ought to be stripped of both his assets and his clothes - the former given to his victims and the latter replaced with tar, feathers and a free ride to the city limits on a rail.

He got away with it because the SEC helped him and the US government encourages his behavior with perks and tax cuts only those with money enjoy.

Also, as a devout atheist, you appeals to fictional characters hold no water with me.

Interesting note - the Aramaic word for camel and rope are similar, so that passage from Luke is likely a mistranslation - "For it is easier for a ROPE to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God" makes way more sense anyway. More evidence for the veracity and infallibility of the Bible eh?.

As for your bible verses Leftdog , it was hard for a rich man because the first church ( AKA REAL CHRISTIANS ) gave up their possesions to the elders and lived together, kinda like the hutterittes. Jesus was responding to the rich young ruler who was asking Jesus what he had to do, in which Jesus answered, "sell your possesions and give to the poor and follow me" . You'd be hard pressed to find any true Christians on the earth today
( unless you visit the commom ground at 79 Sherbrook street in Winnipeg , I have a feeling you might run into some there )

The "eye of the needle" was an actual place, where the camels barely made it through, they couldn't carry anything.....and that is what Jesus was referring to....if you want to follow him, you have to leave your possessions and money bag behind.

BTW, just because you belive in free markets doesn't mean you are a greedy bible thumper.

Whooee! Like ol' Woody sed, "Some'll rob you with a six-gun and some with a fountain pen."

In these dark days of doom'n'gloom an' corporate skullduggery an' greed an' callousness, there's one small bright spot we can look to for some cheer: Conrad Black.

JB

Dailyrant ... you MISSED my point when you wrote ... "BTW, just because you belive in free markets doesn't mean you are a greedy bible thumper."

My point was that MOSR greedy bible thumpers have total faith in free markets ... the reverse of how you interpreted it!

"The "eye of the needle" was an actual place, where the camels barely made it through, they couldn't carry anything.....and that is what Jesus was referring to....if you want to follow him, you have to leave your possessions and money bag behind."

Actually, that's a rationalization and post hoc justification for the error in the Bible, in a ham-fisted attempt to keep the Bible infallible.

The portion of the wall into Jerusalem to which you refer did not exist at the time of Jesus and was so named centuries later, after Arabs had taken over the city.

But I digress.

You have in fact, entirely missed Buck's point. I am an atheist, who totally believes truly freed markets are the way to go - decentralized, emergent and self-organizing, rather than top-down, command and control hierarchies.

I also think greed is a problem, because it causes incentives that lead away from freedom - it is greed and lust for power that allow people like Madoff to use and abuse the power of the state and its regulations to defraud and steal while protecting themselves from harm.

Buck and I don't see eye to eye on a lot of things, but he is right.

BTW, try reading Matthew 25 a little more. It really makes Jesus out to be a Communist, much to the anti-Christian chagrin of nobs like Joel Osteen and Pat Robertson.